How Will This Feed The Poor of Venezuela, Hugo?
From Novosti
MOSCOW, June 27 - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez will arrive in the Russian capital Wednesday.
Russian experts said contracts on supplies of new armaments to Venezuela could be signed during the visit, and that Venezuela could buy up to nine Project 636 Kilo-class diesel submarines.
"Five Project 636 submarines with missile munitions are likely to be bought," Konstantin Makiyenko, an expert with Russia's Technology Strategy Analysis Center, said. "But in the end Venezuela could buy nine submarines."
Russian business daily Kommersant said earlier in June that during his visit to Russia, Chavez could finalize a deal to purchase Russian diesel submarines for the Venezuelan Navy. The contract reportedly is for the supply of five Project 636 Kilo-class diesel submarines and four state-of-the-art Project 677 Amur submarines.
The value of the contracts, depending on the final size of the order, is estimated at $1-2 billion, the paper said, citing its own sources in the defense industry.
Russian Foreign Ministry spokesman Mikhail Kamynin said earlier that Russia-Venezuela trade last year reached $90 million, and that both countries are interested in further mutually beneficial cooperation in the trade and economic sphere.
He said the fuel and energy sectors play a key role in the two countries' economies, adding that Russian energy companies Gazprom, LUKoil, Zarubezhneftegaz and others are increasing their presence on the Venezuelan market.
Venezuela is the world's second-largest importer of Russian military hardware after Algeria. In 2005-2006, it ordered $3.4 billion worth of hardware and weaponry from Russia, including 24 Su-30MK2V Flanker fighters, Tor-M1 air defense missile systems, Mi-26 Halo heavy transport helicopters, and 100,000 AK-103 Kalashnikov assault rifles.
The Project 636 design is a generally improved development of the Project 877EKM Kilo class that represents an interim design between the standard Kilo-class and the new Lada project.
The submarine has improved range, firepower, acoustic characteristics and reliability, and is actively promoted on world markets by the Russian state-run arms exporter, Rosoboronexport.
Russia has repeatedly stated that it would actively participate in the modernization of the Venezuelan armed forces until 2013.
Chavez said earlier speaking on the Hello President television show that he plans to meet with Russian business circles, and visit the lower house of parliament.
MOSCOW, June 27 - Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez will arrive in the Russian capital Wednesday.
Russian experts said contracts on supplies of new armaments to Venezuela could be signed during the visit, and that Venezuela could buy up to nine Project 636 Kilo-class diesel submarines.
"Five Project 636 submarines with missile munitions are likely to be bought," Konstantin Makiyenko, an expert with Russia's Technology Strategy Analysis Center, said. "But in the end Venezuela could buy nine submarines."
Russian business daily Kommersant said earlier in June that during his visit to Russia, Chavez could finalize a deal to purchase Russian diesel submarines for the Venezuelan Navy. The contract reportedly is for the supply of five Project 636 Kilo-class diesel submarines and four state-of-the-art Project 677 Amur submarines.
The value of the contracts, depending on the final size of the order, is estimated at $1-2 billion, the paper said, citing its own sources in the defense industry.
Russian Foreign Ministry spokesman Mikhail Kamynin said earlier that Russia-Venezuela trade last year reached $90 million, and that both countries are interested in further mutually beneficial cooperation in the trade and economic sphere.
He said the fuel and energy sectors play a key role in the two countries' economies, adding that Russian energy companies Gazprom, LUKoil, Zarubezhneftegaz and others are increasing their presence on the Venezuelan market.
Venezuela is the world's second-largest importer of Russian military hardware after Algeria. In 2005-2006, it ordered $3.4 billion worth of hardware and weaponry from Russia, including 24 Su-30MK2V Flanker fighters, Tor-M1 air defense missile systems, Mi-26 Halo heavy transport helicopters, and 100,000 AK-103 Kalashnikov assault rifles.
The Project 636 design is a generally improved development of the Project 877EKM Kilo class that represents an interim design between the standard Kilo-class and the new Lada project.
The submarine has improved range, firepower, acoustic characteristics and reliability, and is actively promoted on world markets by the Russian state-run arms exporter, Rosoboronexport.
Russia has repeatedly stated that it would actively participate in the modernization of the Venezuelan armed forces until 2013.
Chavez said earlier speaking on the Hello President television show that he plans to meet with Russian business circles, and visit the lower house of parliament.
posted by Trevor Loudon at
6/28/2007 01:25:00 PM
55 Comments:
No surprise about this. Any Chavez defenders that simply promote the propaganda from Chavez's regime are simply on the side of "former" Soviet Russia.
Should be useful to kill Yankie invaders with, though. Nice one, Hugo
"Should be useful to kill Yankie invaders with, though. Nice one, Hugo"
Look in the mirror and see what sort of totalitarian movement you are supporting.
a good damn good looking one.
Come to your new graveyard in Caracas, yankie boy
"a good damn good looking one.
Come to your new graveyard in Caracas, yankie boy"
So you have the gall to lecture me that you favor "world peace" when it involves killing an American like myself? You're nothing more than a totalitarian ideologue who wishes to have the likes of Hugo Chavez to rule over Latin America over an iron fist.
You and the Red World Order deserve to meet your demise.
Don't respond MAH-we're dealing with a very sick boy here.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
I really wonder about you Trev. You're no libertarian, you're quite a fascist really !
"I really wonder about you Trev. You're no libertarian, you're quite a fascist really !"
So I take you standing up to someone who wants to kill Americans is quite find with you?
A joint US/Australia exercise in Queensland shows the militarization of the outback.
Aussies buy several ships, planes from the US-this is okay with Trevor since he doesn't criticize it. Libertarian seems to be a convenient veneer which Trevor hides under.
It's same bloody excuse used in Iraq.
US blames Iran for importing EFP into Iraq, but trivializes the Depleted Uranium that their own weapons; which have poisoned the landscape.
Australia then deploys troops in Northern Territory to crack down on Aboriginal communities and not even a mention from this blog.
"Aussies buy several ships, planes from the US-this is okay with Trevor since he doesn't criticize it. Libertarian seems to be a convenient veneer which Trevor hides under."
Knock off your propaganda bull. Chavez supporters have openly supported killing Americans. But I guess having military pacts with some nations are more equal than others with the likes of you.
"Australia then deploys troops in Northern Territory to crack down on Aboriginal communities and not even a mention from this blog."
Isn't that a load of bull?
"Oh and how Diego Garcia natives who were mass deported by the Anglo Americans."
Please knock off your pro-Soviet propaganda rants. Chavez is buddy-buddies with Vladimir Putin and you don't give a damn about it.
Chavez and Putin didn't invade Iraq as George Galloway said "under a pack of lies!"
Is it propoganda or blow back?
You mean take a word from someone who supported the likes of the late Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein? How about someone who is closely affiliated with various Communist front groups in Britain linked to the Communist Party of Britain?
Yea, I should certainly take the word from someone who supported openly the Soviet cause during the Cold War, and continues to do so under Communist front groups. Not. All this talk about "peace" is complete bull from pro-Soviet propagandists like anonymous.
Actions speak louder than words.
Wake me when the likes of Putin, Chavez, Galloway and all those other pro-Communist types stop being pro-Communist and stop favoring the Soviet totalitarian cause.
I don't hear complaints about the Russian invasion of Chechnya or supporting Hamas or its decades of support for the notorious terror group, the Palestinian Liberation Organization (PLO). Guess some invasions and support for these sort of causes are more equal than others.
Actually some of those Russian Kilo class subs would be perfect for NZ (and it would drive the facist supporting anon above crazy if NZ got them too).
I believe that back in the 80s the Dairy board was offered several diesel subs from the Soviets in lieu of payment for butter etc.
I always wondered why the Dairy board didn't take them up on their offer - it would help our butter access into Europe if the Diary Board had a few subs lurking off the French Riveria!!
EXOCET
To Mah29001,
Didn't hear your complaints when Hamas won elections but wasn't recognised by US, UK. EU etc.
It seems that that only elections sanctioned by this group, will receive their support.
Now the situation in Gaza has proven that that a state within a state is counter productive to stability.
"Didn't hear your complaints when Hamas won elections but wasn't recognised by US, UK. EU etc."
So it's still justifiable for Hamas to continue to air Mickey Mouse to teach Palestinians to hate Jews? Hey, the Nazis and the Fascists were also elected.
Do you also give a damn that the Communist Party USA seems to also be in love with your sort of pro-Soviet propaganda? Like removal of U.S. bases? Why not turn the clock and just allow Imperial Japan to invade Australia so that everyone in the region can speak Japanese?
WW2 correlations is a straw man fallacy.
How about extraordinary rendition or Abu Gharib and Gitmo?
Is that democracy and freedom?
Note communism is not an issue.
Anybody who quotes George Galloway needs their heads read. George is still under investigation for his part in the oil for food scandal where he personally profited and still denies despite an alarming amount of evidence against him.
I thnk that Anon is forgetting that Chavez is saying all this anti American rhetoric because he has nothing else to give his population. He hasn't addressed the murder rate in Venezuela despite it being the worst in latin America. He is happier to import as many guns as possible so that his poorly educated population are tricked that he is fighting a war against the evil America, when in theory the US have barely looked in his direction.
Perhaps Anon can answer why Chavez is not too likely to want to steo down from power when his time is up? Stop changing the subject and answer those as well as what Trev and others have bought up! It's a little silly when all you can do is run your mouth about America and avoid answering the given questions!
Those kilo subs will be sunk within minutes of any engagement with a US attack sub. The kilo is a quiet sub - when running on battery power. But once she schnorkels for air, she'll be as noisy as a rock concert and the American sub commander will be marking the kill from around 20 nm away.
The Flanker is an impressive fighter, but in the end, the thing that made the SU and MiG fighters so good was not the avionics but the well trained Soviet pilot, for whom expensive fuel and weapons expenditure was not an issue. In the event of the Gringos attack the Vezzies, I would expect the Flankers to be mostly destroyed on the ground, probably by the same US attack subs above. (Improved Los Angeles Class)
100,000 Kalashnikov rifles? Colour me unimpressed. The ability to win wars between conventional armies is based on the ability to project power, not numbers on the ground. A B52 or USS 688i sub firing missiles from 100nm away is far more effective than divisions of troops angrily waving their rifles at burning effigies of Bush.
However, the arms buildup may be of more concern to neigbouring Latin American nations - Colombia, Guyana and Trinidad may well be somewhat more concerned than Uncle Sam.
If your government had been overthrown in a coup briefly and your President detained, supported at least morally (if not materially) by the USA and were constantly threatened by US government rhetoric I think you'd be arming up to defend against US aggression too. Just think of the USA's history in Latin America. It has been overthrowing governments, invading sovereign nations and committing other dirty deeds for well over a century.
I may not like the arms trade or militarism but I can see where Chavez is coming from.
Like most "peace activist" Cameron, it appears you're willing to cut the "left" a break.
Funny how your anti militarist principles only apply to one side of the political spectrum.
"WW2 correlations is a straw man fallacy.
How about extraordinary rendition or Abu Gharib and Gitmo?
Is that democracy and freedom?
Note communism is not an issue."
Taking the propaganda line with this? Does Abu Gharib or GITMO are on the lines as the totalitarian state of Communist Cuba? Does Fidel ever go about and demand investigations into beating down his dissidents? How about the likes of your buddy Chavez?
Why do the Iraqis wish that Americans could retain control over Abu Gharib if it was so horrible for them? Why do prisoners who are released from GITMO are reported to head back to terrorism?
Trev,
Like yourself you cut the rightwing a break.
Why did Colin Powell call for Gitmo's closure. "Not tommorow, This Afternoon!"
Why did 2 British SAS (disguied as Arabs)get caught in Basra reported in the media; after firing at Iraqi Police. Later the British assaulted the Prison and freed the prisoners.
Divide and Conquer.
I also take that you anonymous don't really care that Galloway suggested that the 7/7 London attacks were justified, and that London just dodged another major attack today.
You seriously want to support these sort of folks like your boy Hugo who seems to be aligned with them with his buddy Ahmadinejad?
That load of propaganda came from the World Socialist Website. Yea, some "realiable" sources that is. Notice how anonymous takes info from websites that lean toward socialism as a "realiable" news source.
yankie invaders into anyone elses country are fair game, mah. just like ruskie invaders would have been in that film Red Dawn.
Neither washington nor moscow!
he said-
The ability to win wars between conventional armies is based on the ability to project power, not numbers on the ground. A B52 or USS 688i sub firing missiles from 100nm away is far more effective than divisions of troops angrily waving their rifles at burning effigies of Bush.
we say-
iraq is the new graveyard for yankie soldiers- humvees, helicpoters and abrams all taken out by home made IEDs. Even yankie top brass admit they are in a tactical swamp they can't get out of.
Venezuelan tactics in event of invasion will be mass guerrilla war, a continental uprising throughout Latin America, massive trade union solidarity from Lation trade unionists within the USA, and possibly massive international attacks on american property throughout the world.
Borat says-
High Five!
Please anonymous,
Don't spread around propaganda from the mouth of the "moderate"/"anti-Stalinist" Trotskyite Fourth International This propaganda bull won't work. You coming onto a right-wing blogspot is akin to a neo-Nazi trying to get Jews to stop supporting Israel and promote anti-Semitic propaganda. It's not going to happen.
If all you can do is support America's enemies and voice for Americans to be killed while you lecture how the right-wing and the U.S. are "enemies of peace", then you seriously need some help. Yet another by-product of the Soviet-cause anonymous is as how the likes of Anatoliy Golitsyn predicted in his Perestroika Deception book.
Well if that website didn't meet you standards of independent sources.
How about Stuff's article of the SAS agent provocateur.
Not enough? How about BBC's article of the SAS duo.
Guardian Post article on the SAS manufactored terror.
Please knock off this propaganda. Trusting left-wing orientated groups like the BBC or the Guardian? Sorry, not buying your propaganda scheme, or your conspiracymongering.
Freedom of Speech am I entitled to that?
If my opinions are considered propoganda, is your harangue anti-propoganda?
Really having both sides of the story only makes other readers more informed.
Read on John Pilger's speech.
Why should I pay attention to the likes of the far left/pro-Communist John Pilger for any particular reason? You keep on stating how much you are "against" propaganda, but then rely on folks like Pilger, Chomsky and other fellow far left/pro-Communist ideologues?
Pilger shook hands with the likes of Hugo Chavez on his visit to Venezuela and aligns himself with Vladimir Putin who watered down the horrible Stalinist purges. You lecture how you "promote" both sides of the story, but when it comes to promoting Pilger, Galloway, Chomsky, etc. who DONOT take both sides into account exposes just where you are coming from.
Everyone's a communist in your eyes. President Bush was pictured interacting with Putin, does that make him one too?
Bush hosts the Dictator of Pakistan, does that mean they're birds of a feather?
Bush said WMDs were in Iraq. Do you still believe him?
Pilger exposes another dimension that, you subverters gloss over. Balance views enrich a democratic system. Unless you want to have book burning ceremonies and have the secret police round up academics, for Siberia salt mines.
"Pilger exposes another dimension that, you subverters gloss over. Balance views enrich a democratic system. Unless you want to have book burning ceremonies and have the secret police round up academics, for Siberia salt mines."
Once again, you are exposed as nothing more than a far left and even pro-Soviet propagandist. Pilger openly greeted the Venezuelan elected dictator-Hugo Chavez who is openly aligning himself with "former" KGB man-Vladimir Putin. You simply post your propaganda because you are upset about Trev revealing Hugo's open links with the Kremlin.
And btw, Bush wasn't the first one who stated WMDs were in Iraq, but those in the Clinton Administration did, even the likes of John Kerry openly stated WMDs were in Iraq, along with Al Gore and the rest of the far left Democratic bunch.
And why don't you ever believe the likes of Georges Sada, a high-ranking Iraqi military defector who stated that Iraq's WMDs were removed into Syria?
You lecture how "balanced" your views are, but then promote people like Pilger who align themselves with the Kremlin and receive weapons and even likely a future nuke project? All you do is spread disinformation and disinform others, but pretend that you are not such a thing.
"Unless you want to have book burning ceremonies and have the secret police round up academics."
Charging me with totalitarian leanings while you ignore your boy Chavez openly aligning himself with the Kremlin and also being backed by the Communist Party of the Russian Federation/Soviet Union, one of the most totalitarian Communist parties? I have never advocated a secret police nor round up academics.
Such a libel and typical charge from a pro-Soviet propagandist.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
PigIron factory for Mah once those Venezuelan tanks get rolling. Or maybe a re education camp
Mah Mah Mia, in that highly disgusted tone of his "...shaking the hand of the likes of Chavez..."
Quel Horreur ! Get the children inside quick !
I say - re Mah's hero, the recenly retired Donald Rumsfeld -
"...shaking the hand of Saddam Hussein Baghdad '84 - when Rummy ALREADY KNEW that the Butcher was gassing the Kurds.
Now don't lie Mah - you know that's true - you've seen the photographs !
So who's to be more lambasted, Pilger or Rummy ? I mean Rummy KNEW the gassing and the murder the Butcher was up to. He just went on and sold alot of helicopters and armaments that day.
But the bastard Pilger shook the hand of the bastard Chavez...
Encore: Quel Horreur !
Grow up Mah, sick wee man. Unerring judge of everyone and everything....yeah right !
Mah declaims John Kerry and Al Gore as - "that 'far left' democratic bunch..."
Get a grip darling...! If you wanna be taken half seriously that is.
Steve, knock it off. Hugo Chavez is openly aligning himself with not just those in the Kremlin or his buddies in Belarus, but also aligning himself with Mahmoud Ahmadinejad who has been known to support international terrorism.
You think it's alright you support someone who loves to deny the holocaust and even inviting the likes of David Duke over to a holocaust denial conference along with a bunch of other holocaust deniers?
You Steve are the sick one for supporting someone like Chavez who is aligning himself with Jew-killers and Jew-baiters like Ahmadinejad. For you to continue your dishonesty certainly exposes your lack of knowledge and what sort of disinformation you are promoting.
Mah 29001 is Rumsfield's Lolita, who adores blood letting and the military industrial complex.
Your boy George W is a lame Duck President destined for the heap and Helen Clark is on her way out with Johnny Howard the poodle's pooper scooper.
"Mah 29001 is Rumsfield's Lolita, who adores blood letting and the military industrial complex.
Your boy George W is a lame Duck President destined for the heap and Helen Clark is on her way out with Johnny Howard the poodle's pooper scooper."
Please knock off the Communist/pro-Soviet bull propaganda. And when did I say I ever love Rumsfield?
You don't take appreciation for what you really have in the West do you? Being able to criticize Western leaders freely, while you at the same time are an apologist for pro-Soviet totalitarian states in the Middle East and even the terrorist groups they support, along with electable dictators like Hugo Chavez who certainly wants to be like his mentor-Fidel Castro.
You'll lose everything for what sort of world you really want to see the West become subverted to, and that's a freedomless Red World Order.
Cameron and others may well know where Hugo Chavez is coming from,but do they know where he's going (to)? Think Mugabe,but with more guns.
Freedom of Expression is great isn't it, Mah Baker 29001?
It is easy letting Communism drops off the side of your mouth so easily, like something well lubricated.
"Freedom of Expression is great isn't it, Mah Baker 29001?
It is easy letting Communism drops off the side of your mouth so easily, like something well lubricated."
Knock off your peddiness troll.
Ah, slippery slope of communism.
Mah 29001, mouth is sure "well-lubricated" with cookie cutter tags.
Left wing, Right wing, Communist, Athiest, Evangelist, Gay, Anti-gay, Capitalist hater, environmentalist,
terrorist, ant-terror, counter terror,
Mah, please be honest and do get it right. I am not, never have been, a supporter of Duke and similar lunatics.
I mean, you're in no doubt that I'm not a suppporter of yours, aren't you Mah......?
I've told you before - it is you who loves the existence of the likes of them. You can hide your own Holocaust Naziism behind the grossness of those evil sideshows.
You're both gross, living as you do on near opposite ends of the same spectrum.
So stop you willful lies about who I support !
Anonymous and Steve, please get a life instead of trolling around.
Mah Mah, you're clearly not particularly au fait with aspects of the modern sexual dynamic.....(wonder why ???)
If you mean to tell me to stop talking shit then by all means do so.....your customary and endearing - "Shut it Steve !" - will do.
But telling me not to troll around conveys something else possibly.....I'm just not like that Mah Mah !
Get a life Steve, because I have had it with your bullying tactic and speaking of "talking shit" as you claim I keep on doing, stop your harassment of lauding me to be a "holocaust Nazi fanatic", a "Nazi" and a "fascist".
This is harassment what you are doing Steve. Coming onto every post that I happen to be on this blog for the sole purpose of lauding those abusive comments to me.
This is truely trollish behavior and if you can't see that, well, that's your problem.
What for is Chavez purchasing this armament ? Is he planning to do an armed revolution in Latin america as Fidel did in Cuba on 1959 ? An armed revolution that "Che Gevara" intented on 1967 from Bolivia ? or will he support terrorism like the montoneros who intended to take over control of argentina by force 1975 from Tucuman rainforest ? Is the coldwar starting again ?
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